M/A Comm Opensky

[nitornemo]

Anyone have any good links to this new system?

I know Kenwood is building the radios for them but most sites I've found don't have much info

My agency has agreed into a contract with M/A Comm to re-equip the entire fleet

[n_zero_ndp]

Anyone have any good links to this new system?

I know Kenwood is building the radios for them but most sites I've found don't have much info

My agency has agreed into a contract with M/A Comm to re-equip the entire fleet

Probably already been here, but...

http://www.opensky.com/about.asp

I think Gordon (NodrogCop) is going to get the OpenSky stuff soon over there on the statewide system in the Keystone state......

[nitornemo]

Yup been there!
Thanks for the reply tho!

There's alot of info that's missing from my point of view.
They mention AMBE, CDPD,TDMA,
19.2kbps on a 25MHz(? so much for narrowbanding)channel,VOIp,OTAR(®/\/\?),etc.
Can't find detailed tech data,
AMBE...Inter-op with IMBE?
800MHz...already Trashed by Nextel sites
operate with either OpenSky® digital channels or conventional analog FM networks.
Will it talk to our Smartnet analog system?
I know the EFJ radios that are APCO25 BOAST Smartnet®
Etc-etc.

Probably already been here, but...
http://www.opensky.com/about.asp
I think Gordon (NodrogCop) is going to get the OpenSky stuff soon over there on the statewide system in the Keystone state......

[1 ADAM 12]

They where down south a year or two ago and trying to find customers...
Rep got bent out of shape when I mention that the portable case was Kenwoods design... They demo'd a mike with a GPS antenna for portable users and a mobile that handles a laptop and voice off the same unit and their infrastructure. They are their own world, however the big thing is "voice over IP" and that they can link using their interfaces and a radio to anything out there.. It really relied heavily on computers and all I can say is backups and battery back-up in time of need. The units will do conventional, and there is encryption but is not high level. I had some info and will see if I can find it. Two things at the time ..we couldn't find a public safety user that actually had a WHOLE or COMPLETED system. Every one that they gave us was under construction, though at the time and you may have seen it in the magazines they advertised the Pennsylvania system like it was completed.

[nitornemo]

I did see that they are running user "TRAINING" classes for PA.
Is the system there done yet?

They have 2 major offices here one is 10mi from where I live....wonder if they'd mind if I up and Drop By one day

Every one that they gave us was under construction, though at the time and you may have seen it in the magazines they advertised the Pennsylvania system like it was completed.

[NodrogCop]

The statewide system in PA is not done yet, although it is my understanding that the state police are starting to have some barracks and troopers play around with it here in the Harrisburg area. I haven't seen any lately to ask, but I'll try. I do know all the PSP cars I have seen do have the mobiles installed.

Our county as well as another one nearby (Lancaster and Cumberland counties for those familiar with the area) are piggybacking onto the statewide system. Originally (~1999 or so), we were to be deployed the middle of next month. Because of delays, bankruptcies, and other messes, the last I heard was that public safety would be on the system sometime in 2005-6...and that's not definite, as the promise made to us (Police, Fire, EMS) was that none of would be on until the bugs were worked out. Too bad my dept's radios are 12-13 year old PCS's and won't be replaced.

Didn't know the radios were Kenwood design. That's interesting. I have wondered about OpenSky's interoperability, especially in light of 9/11 and the Homeland Security issues with it.

nitornemo, I will try and make contact with the County liaison and see if I can dig up information. As n_zero_npd knows, I've been trying to get info for a while. Unfortunately, other things have popped up. I'll work on that before the weekend and see what I can come up with. If you haven't been already, try these two sites: http://www.radio.state.pa.us/radioproje ... efault.asp and http://www.lcwc.co.lancaster.pa.us/lcwc ... efault.asp (click on 800 Mhz Radio System on the left hand side of the page)

Also - one last disturbing thought. The last I had heard, the most successful implementation of this system was for FedEx's Denver shipping hub - and that was more than 3/4 data transmission. I do not know of any public safety entity that’s used it. Some here have wondered if we are M/A Com's guinea pig to sell it to others. Provided the system is up before it's obsolete...


Gordon

[n_zero_ndp]

Some here have wondered if we are M/A Com's guinea pig to sell it to others. Provided the system is up before it's obsolete...


Gordon

LMAO
I have a familiar feeling of deja vu...... Our EDACS system here is falling so far behind the times. Our system cannot yet support ProVoice & by the time we can, they will have another new format

98% of our PD vehicles still have the Rangr...
At least the FD has reasonably current radios: single head-dual radio Orions, MRK1 walkies for field use & the LPE200 for admin.

[1 ADAM 12]

Not sure if the actual radio is made by Kenwood... but they are using the Kenwood 290/390 case, battery, mike etc. It may be that they are making the board and then dropping them in. They got real defensive when I inquired. It just seemed that the flexibility of the radio to operate with- out the support of the system is questionable. They really didn't like me when I asked.... if you where talking with a County to the north of you while, thats a Motorola system and you continue north, and go beyond the range of your MA/COM system... not only are you going to loose the home system but also connection to the Motorola system they where linking you to...so only conventional was an option after that. I then pointed out that witha users agreement if you where running either Motorola or EDACS you could still use the conventional but if you had the option available to you could also trunk on the corresponding system...because the radio didn't have to rely on the switch. I also inquired about a mutual aid situations when going to other counties, since unless you where gonna trailer a system to go with you ( possible frequency interference issues etc) that you would be using conventional or once again if you had the radio that could handle the system join up on their system... In this case this system would have been surrounded by almost all Motorola Smartnet systems.... Now I basically was just concerned with our local area, but I saw some real problems It also didn't help that I had researched every possible link I could find and found no real public safety operating on a completed system.... They basically would not acknowledge me after that ... not a real good sales approach.. I would rather have heard.. its something we are working on... we have dealt with it yet etc.... I just know that it seems since this was brought up 5 years ago and the 2 years ago and then last year, that Pennsylvania had not made much headway.

[GE-RADIO-GUY]

>>so much for narrowbanding

Who said there was only just one(1) voice/data transmission within that 25 kHz of bandwidth?

There are several...





[quote="nitornemo"]Yup been there!
Thanks for the reply tho!

There's alot of info that's missing from my point of view.
They mention AMBE, CDPD,TDMA,
19.2kbps on a 25MHz(? so much for narrowbanding)channel,VOIp,OTAR(®/\/\?),etc.

[NodrogCop]

Who said there was only just one(1) voice/data transmission within that 25 kHz of bandwidth?

There are several...

Last I checked, there were going to be 4 transmissions, at least on our County's system....

Gordon

[nitornemo]

Almost a year from my 1st post on this....

We now have some radios up, but only on a conventional 800 channel crossbanded to our existing 470 system.

feh. Still can't get any straight (or crooked)answers on this.

Anyone know anything new?

Anyone have any good links to this new system?

I know Kenwood is building the radios for them but most sites I've found don't have much info

My agency has agreed into a contract with M/A Comm to re-equip the entire fleet

[radio259]

Information I got first hand from two elected officials in high positions:
Rhon tower went belly up last year. They had the contract for tower sites needed. Now as of late August, this is supposedly resolved.

This is not the state police radio system any more. it is the state of PA radio system. Other agencies are now joining the system. State prisons, PEMA, DOJ, Parole and Probation, and we now are scheduled to install radios in PA DOT trucks beginning late winter.

There is another web site who have a few members "bashing" this system.

They are pro " the other brand radio" folk. Around where i live, motorola built a 800 system for Fayette county. Cost "X" million bucks. Cost more million to get near adequate coverage.

Westmoreland county, from what I heard talking to two fire chiefs, is having the same problem. They basically did not want 800 period. It does not work well with our terrain in PA.

Seems more teknology changes or advances, the more bugs get thrown in the system.

There is no guarente for true 100% coverage with any system.

The state is still installing sites, and mobiles from what we have been told.

Yes the cost has risen, but there have been many changes/ad ons from the initial bid package that was signed. This will happen with almost any large scale system in any state or county.

Me, I still prefer our old lowband system. It worked.

Just my 3 cents

[Pj]

I know what site you are talking about, but I think it comes down to $$$ and being able to deliever your product.

Not that I am looking to start a debate in anyway, but MA/COM hasn't delivered anything of real substance since they introduced OpenSky. On paper is sounds like a really nice system, but they haven't been able to get everything to work as previously stated.

Where as...

Smartnet/SmartZone is proven
EDACS is proven
LTR (as much as its not a real system )

800 is the preferred band for intergating voice/data, but if you look around, a few agencies are actually impletementing VHF/UHF TRS. As much as NV screwed up, they had a VHF SmartZone system. I do agree that PA sucks for 800, but it does so for widearea coverage anywhere in the northeast.

[talviar]

They are pro " the other brand radio" folk. Around where i live, motorola built a 800 system for Fayette county. Cost "X" million bucks. Cost more million to get near adequate coverage.

Care to back this statement up with fact?

Considering I work at the agency in question here and don't remember spending additional millions to get near adequate coverage. . . .

Original system design was and still is for mobile coverage in 95% of the county using 35 Watt Spectra Mobiles or equivalent. . . Most of the people on the fringes that are having trouble bought GTX portables and mobiles. . . Same folks that don't blink an eye at spending $$$ on new fire/ems/police apparatus but squak at having to spend a little bit on a good radio.

Upgrades included (1) 800 MHz conventional repeater to coverage eastern fringe around Markleysburg and I believe 2 individual sites with signal enhancers to fill in two populated trouble spots. (might have been 3)
That was around (100K)

Only other upgrade was to add 2 repeaters at each tower site to expand from 5 channel to 7 channel . . . .

As far as the "old low band" goes, from my fire district (Ohiopyle, PA) I can call all day long on a 110W lowband mobile on 33.70 and never get through to Fayette County 911 (or 301 Uniontown in the old days prior to Fayette 911 same base at same tower so don't tell me it's due to an equipment change) due to the traffic on the channel . . . . Could call my base at my fire house as long as I'm not more than 3 or 4 miles away again due to traffic on the channel. Generally get thru on a handheld 800 radio on first or second shot. . . .

The Statewide Opensky system (at least to the base in my comm center) seems to be working. . . PSP is using the opensky system via their computers that are in the car and having some coverage problems in the fringe areas. These are the same spots that have non existent/poor coverage on their existing 155.670/155.910 channel . . . .

Enough on my rant

Tony

[NodrogCop]

I've been meaning to reply to this for a while, and kept forgetting about it...

Anyway....

Our county's deployment of OpenSky has been delayed significantly by the bankruptcy of Rohn. The minimum set-back is six months, but the realistic figure is twelve to eighteen months. We're already a couple of years, so what's some more time?

As I understand it, Cumberland County (just to the west of Harrisburg) is to be loading users onto their system anytime now. The goal was mid-October, however, I haven't been able to speak to anyone to find out. I'll be at the local M/A Com dealer to pick up a portable and will try to find out.

I do know, as others have said, that PA state police are using OpenSky for data transmission and are having only a few problems. That's good news, for a change. There is no timetable as to when they're going to go to voice, though.

When I dropped off the aforementioned radio, one of the techs at the dealer said he had seen OpenSky work in a small scale setting. He said it worked very well, and was hopeful that the other systems would follow suit. Of course, as we both agreed, it depends on well the design is --- are we (as Lancaster County) going to have put up more towers? I hope not, and we'll see.

I've been a skeptic of this system because, as Pj has pointed out, we could've gone with Mother Moto, or in staying with M/A Com, with EDACS. I'm a little more comforted after talking to the tech, but the delays and cost overruns...you gotta wonder.

Of course, the new 7100P radios are pretty sweet. 'course, for ~2k a pop, I guess they should be.

I'll post more as I can find out... It's good to hear from brethren in the western part of the commonwealth. I'm fond of over there...well, northwestern, anyway.


Gordon